"Trillion, trillion, trillion. Effectively, that's the coverage, if you're a streamer, you will need to have in this brave new world of IPv6. Exactly. Yep, it makes the 4.3 billion IPv4 addresses easy to track, in comparison."- John McArthur
In his inaugural episode of Lock & Shield, John McArthur breaks out the virtual popcorn and talks to Neustar Product Manager Paige Enoch about the consumption of streaming content during COVID-19, as well as how streaming providers look to geolocation data for accurate content delivery and licensing rights validation.
Most importantly, join them as they discuss what the growth in viewership during COVID-19 for streamers including Disney+, Amazon Prime, Netflix, HBO Max, Hulu, and YouTube TV means for the future of secure content delivery.
Have feedback or a cybersecurity topic you would like us to dig into on this podcast? We would love to hear from you! Drop us a quick note at firstname.lastname@example.org.
John McArthur: Trillion, trillion, trillion. Effectively, that's the coverage that if you're a streamer, it sounds like with this new brave new world of IPv6 protocol v six, that's the kind of coverage you understand need to have. Exactly. Yep, it makes the 4.3 billion IPv4 addresses, easy to track. In comparison. So, just curious, what is kind of the sausage making, if you will, around putting the IPv6 data together?
Sound clip: The time is not too far ahead, when you will be able to have a box about so big on your desk, which has a little screen on it, and a dial. And after dialing a key code, you will dial the catalog number of any books in the Library of Congress. And at any rate that you wish the spread pages of that book will appear on your television screen.
John McArthur: Alright, welcome, everybody to the inaugural Neustar security solutions podcast. My name is John MacArthur, I'll be your host a brief bio about myself. So, I've worked for Neustar for almost seven years now going back to 2014. Started out here, managing our UltraGeoPoint product line moved over into what we call UltraReputation or risk feeds around IP addresses, and then have taken over our UltraThreat Feeds line of business as well. Joining us today for our podcasts is Paige Enoch who is the product manager for our UltraGeoPoint data set. And Paige is really charged with managing the day to day of the products working with sales engineers, the data science team. And I should say Paige is a recent joiner to the product management team. We were fortunate enough to steal her from the data team, the research team really that puts all this great data together that we'll talk about later in the podcast. So, Paige, do you want to you want to say a few words about your experience and really what it means to be part of the data team, as well as being part of being a product manager.
Paige Enoch: Sure. Thanks, John. Hi, my name is Paige Enoch. And I'm the product manager for UltraGeoPoint. As John mentioned, I've been a Neustar for some time. So, it's been just over six years total started on the data team. And so have a fair amount of time spent there. And really understanding the data, our processes, exactly how things are working and how high quality our data is, and recently made the jump over to the product side. So as John said, I speak pretty consistently with our customers and understanding what they need, and also working internally to make as many improvements as possible.
JM: And that leads right into our topic for today, which is really understanding the impact of COVID, the current pandemic, on distribution of online content. And along with some thoughts around what a post COVID world could look like for digital content. One of the use cases for our data that Paige and I build is, in fact, enforcement of compliance for online streaming. Before we get into all that and some of the technical details, I think it's probably important to just understand a bit of where we are right now, in terms of the world. We're sitting here, May 12th, and looks like very much we have a light at the end of the tunnel. But we know there's been some major impacts, especially you know, globally, for everything we do on a daily basis. And again, one of those areas that we're talking about today is online streaming. And as we think about that it's probably important to call out what the impacts have been on movie theaters. Um, I know I haven't been to a movie in over probably two years now but I'm not a big movie person. So that's not a big surprise. But it's interesting that with this pandemic, we’ve definitely had some behavioral changes around how we're viewing movies, how we're viewing online content. And it's no surprise to anyone that the streaming businesses has been booming throughout the pandemic. At the same time. The movie theater industry has been absolutely clobbered. I grabbed a stat from comScore that basically showed that revenue dropped from 11 and a half billion dollars in 2019, down to 2.2 billion in 2020. So that is dramatic. So, at the end of the day people because of the pandemic have stopped going to the movie theaters, but it's pretty interesting with the pandemic and this this this big decline in people going to the movie theater that's changed the way the studios have thought about releasing content. And you've seen in probably most recently of Warner Brothers announced the hybrid show around releasing their movies with HBO Max, in some of the movies that came to mind as it was doing some research for this, that you know, big, big blockbuster movies like a Godzilla versus Kong, right, that's one you typically would think would be on a big screen, or even Wonder Woman 1984 that was released over the holidays. So, you know, understanding that this that this, the pandemic is impacted, you know, folks in their in their level of comfort going to movie theaters, there's definitely been a shift in that. Let's talk a bit about how did COVID impact the streamers. When we talked about the streamers the Disney's The Netflix's, the Primes of the world out there. So it's crazy. Disney, and this has been widely reported. Disney's subscriber estimates back in December, they, they had to hike them up. Because they were so popular. So when Disney launched 13 months ago, or so they said expected the platform to reach 60 million to 90 million by 2024. They've now re-factored that estimate to be 230, 260 million. So literally a 4x or so jump in projected growth. And obviously, COVID was a big part of that. Now, Netflix hadn't had an interesting situation for themselves, though, in that they actually have been dealing with a bit of flattened growth, at least in Q1 of 2021. And, you know, and Paige, I've talked about this a bit. Part of that is probably because, and I think they readily admitted this, that there's been production delays in some of the new content there. And so there just isn't as much, you know, quote unquote, cool stuff to watch. Although I do you know, from time to time, I see new releases there that I hadn't heard of. But you know, one of the other factors that they've also referenced is that they had such huge spikes in 2020, that they actually think forward subscribed folks ahead of what they were planning. So they took a big hockey stick, if you will, in 2020. And now things are flattening out. Meanwhile, Peacock launch in April 2020, they reported 33 million signups in Q4 and added additional nine in Q1, which was actually more than Netflix’s’ 4 million in Q1. So just goes to show like this market is red hot, even with Netflix flattening in early 2021. That was just carried forward or carried forward earlier in 2020. So really, it's very interesting. I think the other interesting to think about is the number of streaming services per customer is up. The NDP groups connected intelligence TV service, that they ran a study and found that people are looking for entertainment, they spend more time at home due to pandemic. It looks as though folks have at least for streaming services and are paying around $47 per month now on streaming services. And that's crazy. And you know, so no surprise that consumption of streaming content is going up. Now, again, that is some of the customers we deal with at Neustar in the UltraGeoPoint space are in this space. And I guess Paige, have we seen any sort of similar upticks in the volumes of our streaming customers in terms of them looking up IP addresses, and querying our data?
PE: Yeah, we've certainly seen an increase in the traffic generated by our largest streaming customers something like 40%, or an increase of 40% in the last year.
JM: And that's, I mean, 40% that is a ton of additional queries. And I should say, you know, these queries are important, because we'll come to this a bit more later. These queries are, are used to help streaming companies enforce geocoding compliance about where content can be viewed. So, I guess, page this is where I'll ask and I'll have to admit to a few things. After but how many streaming services do you have? Are you using?
PE: I think it's something like six at the moment.
JM: Six. I think I have you beat I think of the big ones the Disney plus the Amazon Prime, Netflix, HBO, Max, Hulu, YouTube TV, I actually say we finally cut the cord here during the pandemic. So you know, we've like a service like YouTube TV became very attracted to us. I think I have about seven or eight. And they have like I'm across the board summer for movies. And then I think I have at least three subscriptions to support services as well. So for while there, you could only the only sports going on where it was like European soccer. So I had to check the box and get ESPN plus they were showing, you know the Italian Soccer League Syria there. So I think I have you beat I'm probably right around that $47 a month range.
So, before we talk a bit more in depth, and I mentioned the use case about how look the data that Paige and I work on help these companies enforce geo compliance rules. Just curious page what has been your favorite streaming movie or series you discovered during the pandemic?
PE: I think it has to be Ted lasso on Apple TV.
JM: Ted lasso is fantastic. Jason Sudeikis is I think the main star. Yep. hysterical. I mean, I'm a big soccer football fan myself both my son's play. I love it. He is it is it is for those who haven't seen it, he's a former football coach from the Midwest of the United States. Yeah, American football, American football moves to move to England to coach a Premier League team. And uses all this funny US sayings, which fall on deaf ears across the pond. You know, I hadn't thought of that. Because Ted Lasso was definitely one of the favorites we found. Obviously, you know, Apple+ is one of the ones we subscribe to. You know, I have to admit, and this is a more recent one. I was pleasantly surprised like by two movies. The Godzilla vs. Kong, which I thought was fantastic. Paige and I talked about this she was not as much of a fan. But that's okay. I have two boys who are big into dinosaurs, and you know, big destruction of things. I don't know what to say. And I think the other one other also very pleasantly surprised by Mortal Kombat, the movie just came out of HBO max. And for someone who spent a fair majority of his youth in arcades, seeing Mortal Kombat brought to life with more gore and intensity that I think was actually in the video games, was really impressive. So, I did enjoy that. Ted Lasso is a good one. I'll give a good recommend to Godzilla vs. Kong and Mortal Kombat myself.
Let's take a quick break from the podcast and talk about some of the fun facts we discovered while researching this streaming content we have today. Did you know the oldest surviving movie we have on film is from 1888. So, the world's earliest surviving motion picture film, showing actual consecutive action is called Roundhay Garden Scene. It's a short film directed by French inventor Louis Le Prince. And while just two seconds long, it's technically a movie. And according to the Guinness Book of World Records, it is the oldest surviving film in existence. Now one of the facts we found while reaching the podcast, this one is a little not necessarily a fun fact, is that the snow in The Wizard of Oz was actually made from asbestos. So, the Wizard of Oz is perhaps the most famous case of this being used on a film set. In the 1920s, content cotton was first used to depict snow and other fluffy white substances but firefighters warned against it as a fire hazard. So instead, they decided to switch over to another health hazard with asbestos. And fake snow companies like Pure White and Snowdrift were born. Especially the snow was used in a lot of ways the Wizard of Oz, including being used as poppy spores, the witches brooms, and pretty much the entire scarecrow outfit. Just goes to show how far we've come from the 20s. And finally, did you know the largest film market out of the United States is China. And maybe this isn't a surprise. But according to The Hollywood Reporter, analysts in Beijing have begun predicting that the territory will easily usurp North America as the world's top grossing theatrical market in the coming years, China no longer relies in Hollywood for its films. Only two of China's top grossing films in 2019 were Hollywood productions.
What fun facts about movies do you want to share? Reach out to us at Lock and Shield at team Neustar that's LOCKANDSHIELD at team dot Neustar.
Now as we move forward here, like to talk a bit about, sounds ominous, the darker side of streaming. And this is where Paige and I tend to get involved. I've made some allusions and talked about a geo compliance, big words, geo compliance and content protection. So I'll say that with more use of some of these online streaming services There came some downsides. And to the point, there's a few different things here that we could that we can talk about. One is password sharing. And, you know, there was a recent announcement, I'm sure folks who are maybe Netflix subscriber saw this is and Forbes reported on this. So apparently Netflix has, at the point the article came out earlier this year, Netflix had 220 million users. And obviously sharing passwords impacts them. They haven't said how many subscribers or connections are, are suspect, but their estimates range from 15 to 30%. So that's a that is, you could argue a lot of lost revenue for Netflix. And I think some customers are trying a system now where some customers are getting messages on their screens, prompting them to sign up for their own accounts. Now, I will attest that, in the past, I might have been guilty of a password share or two, mostly because I was trying to watch my beloved University California Golden Bears play football, I couldn't get access to it. But I pretty much don't do it now and that it's probably a bit hypocritical for Paige and I to be engaged in this business and actually partake of password sharing. And actually to that point, Paige, we actually wrote a paper around password sharing and best practices. And you know, what were what were the big takeaways from that white paper that we had around password sharing, like, how could you stop it?
PE: Yeah. So it really starts with understanding the user's location on the account. And from there, you can really start to build a profile around that user. So, for a given account, is that person coming from California? Are they also coming from Oregon on the same day? Is that feasible? Maybe. But if they're logged in from multiple locations within the same timeframe, say an hour or two, that's starting to look very suspect, if they're across different states, even different countries, that's usually suspect. It's also really important to understand if they're coming from some kind of anonymized connection, so are they connecting via a VPN? That person might not be where they say that they are, and maybe should not have content to their account. So really understanding user location, building a profile, and then putting in some flags and some understanding about that on your platform.
JM: Got it. Got it. And that's interesting. You've talked about, you mentioned VPNs. And I think a lot of people when they think of VPNs. And in, by the way, we're not here to cast judgment, by the way, good or bad on on VPN, but it's interesting VPNs in in our line of work, again, protect your privacy. And that's incredibly important. And we totally understand that. But again, one of the use cases for the IP Geo data we provide is around content protection. And one of the things that VPNs are used for, they're used to bypass content protection laws and Paige, could you describe a bit more about that? Like what is a VPN at the high level, for those of you who don't know, the technical jargon, and how is it used for getting around content protection?
PE: Sure. So just starting with the content protection laws, a lot of content is licensed by geography. So, for a certain country, and users and other countries may not have licensed access to that content. So, VPN is one technology that some users have turned to try and access content in another geography. And a VPN service will allow a user to connect to basically an infrastructure that isn't theirs that is owned by a VPN service. And that infrastructure might be in the country that has the content they're trying to reach. So, if I'm in, say, the UK and I want to watch content in the US, a VPN may be one option that I might explore to try and access that content. I could log into the VPN, select a server in the United States, and that service would take my traffic, it would route it to that server in the United States, and it would make it look like I was coming from the United States. And we have a robust detection system set up to identify these VPNs. Again, to John's point, this isn't to judge and say, this is bad. This is good. It's merely to say this is a VPN, use this information, how you will, to better understand your user.
JM: Along with VPN. Now, are there other ways of bypassing like these geographical content rules that that the content distributors have?
PE: There are it's a pretty consistently shifting landscape. So, there are p2p proxies, which are basically infrastructure setups where you participate in a network of computers, where you are sharing resources with those connected computers, and you were acting as both the server and clients, so it's a different architecture setup. But one result of that is that you can choose one delegate IP address to be your IP. And that is the IP that will be visible to the public Internet, when really, it may be redirecting traffic to your computer. So that is one way to change your source IP address.
JM: So, in a scenario where my mother happens to be a huge fan of telenovelas in Mexico, which is not far off the truth, I think, theoretically, then she could, and she can't get access, obviously, getting access to maybe all the channels that are available in Mexico, for instance, may not be available to her here. Or in California, for instance, where she lives, she could actually then connect to some sort of infrastructure or even like, would it be another person's computer in Mexico to get access to some of the content that might be there?
PE: Potentially. Yeah. So either connecting to their computer and getting access or participating in a network that would have a kind of delegate IP in Mexico?
JM: That is? That is interesting. I don't know, again, given the business we're in, I won't necessarily share with my mother, the ins and outs of all that, but it is I mean, you could see, you know, an example use case, I should say, my mom, I don't know how much she would watch those, but probably not a big, big issue with her. But certainly, there are folks that could be interested in viewing content not available to them. So, you know, maybe this is a good point Paige to take a deeper dive into to our data. And, you know, talk about the different data that we have, uh, you've alluded to location, we've talked about, you know, you mentioned proxies as a way of sort of getting around content protection, how does our data help address those use cases? Like, you know, how does it get location information? What, you know, do you only need country, is country enough? Can go into that for us?
PE: Sure, sure. So, in UltraGeoPoint, we have over 40 fields related to IP addresses. So, for any given IP, we can return up to 40 fields of information around that IP, as John mentioned, and part of those fields are related to geolocation, the “where”. So where in that country is this IP in, what state, what city all the way down to postal code potentially. And depending on the granularity that's needed. That's where that question comes in. Is country enough? Saying the right country is enough, just understanding the country that the user is in, and if it's aligned with those content restrictions. We do have customers that need granularity down to postal code to understand to better understand where that end user is. And tied to these geolocation fields are our confidence factor fields. So, these are relative measures of certainty that we provide. So, we're gauging how certain we are that that IP is in that location. And this can really help in decisioning workflows, as well. So if you're a content provider, you see an IP address come in, you can understand what country it's in, you can understand down to city and what the confidence factors look like, so how confident are we that it's in that location?
JM: Got it. Now, you're talking about location, location of an IP address? And maybe taking, taking a step back to think about it, could you explain really what an IP address is? And then also, you know, there's been a lot of talk around privacy in so I'm wondering, are you tracking John MacArthur's IP address? And do you know, like the lat longitude of where I am somewhere in southwest Ohio?
PE: No. So we are privacy forward and IP focused, we are not user focused. So, the only information we receive are the only requests that we see from our customers, are IP addresses, we do not see or handle any personally identifying information. So, if you were a user requesting services, I would not see your name, I would not see your address, we would only see your IP and IP geolocation is an inexact science. We are not providing something like GPS coordinates for an IP address that can be pinpointed down to a house or a block. We are providing a relative answer for location, so think five miles to 15 miles somewhere in there and not to be used for identifying people
JM: Got it, so the data isn't tracking me like the Jason Bourne movies.
Hey there, want to take a quick break from the podcast and talk to you about our UltraGeoPoint Database? Are you looking for an easy to integrate IP geo database, UltraGeoPoint provides powerful IP geolocation and proxy data. To help you identify and block fraudulent transactions, deliver OTT and streaming media, ensure compliance, and mitigate security threats. The UltraGeoPoint data is made available in a few different ways via Restful API, an on-premise virtual server and flat file to seamlessly integrate into your application stack. And this summer, we are launching a Splunk Technical Add-on to allow Splunk users to leverage the insights of UltraGeoPoint in their security and traffic management use cases. To learn more, please visit home.Neustar and navigate to the Security Solutions section.
What about some of the other fields? The data you mentioned 40 attributes? What are the other sort of key fields you would use around you know Content Protection, and any other content use cases?
PE: Yeah, the other key fields for content and licensing rights validation and alignment would be the proxy fields that we referred to earlier. So, these are also very tied to location. Because if you see a location or an IP address, that is a VPN service, we will provide the location answer but, in that case, it might be the server where the VPN address. So, our proxy fields can really help you add context to that user’s connection and that location. So, we provide four fields related to anonymizer data. One is the anonymizer status. And I'm using the word anonymizer here as a service or system that will change something about the user's IP address, whether that's location behavior, anonymizer would be the industry term for what that IP addresses doing. So, the anonymizer status, in our service indicates if an IP has been detected as an anonymizer. And we really think about these anonymizer IPS as being in two main categories: public and private. And we think of public IPs as being the proxies that you can Google, they're freely available. And you can say connect to this IP and you can use that IP as a proxy address. Private IPs are a little bit more specific to a user, meaning there's more effort required. They generally require payment. So, VPN services usually have some sort of wall there. So, their account based, they require payment, and a user will be able to log into that VPN service and use that infrastructure. So those are the two main categories that we're thinking about when we think about anonymizers. Tor would also fall under a private category as would, web or CGI, those have kind of fallen off in recent times, and VPNs are definitely on the rise out of the various anonymizers. So, another field that we really reference and use is the proxy last detected date. And this field will tell you when we last saw or identified this IP as an anonymizer. So that can help you really just add context to that IP and that connection and see, oh, this was active or tested positive or was detected a month ago, it's very likely that is still in use and should be treated with suspicion. Or maybe it was six months or a year ago you can make some decisions around your level of risk and how you want to balance that choice. Another field is proxy level. So, this indicates the degree of concealment provided by using the proxy, the kind of levels of obfuscation here, there's a few different options or ways that proxies function. Mostly related to headers and how that IP is concealing itself. So, if the proxy level is anonymous, it conceals the end users IP but doesn't hide that it's a proxy, you can see that information in the header. Distorting does obscure the end users IP address, but doesn't hide that it's a proxy and it replaces the end users address with a random IP. So, kind of a fun, fun status there.
JM: Interesting. Okay. And just to on that note, so some of the proxies actually, in the information they send over, advertise the fact that they are in fact, obfuscating information.
PE: Yes. While others don't well, others actually try to basically make it, I guess, “nothing to see here”. This is just normal traffic ignore this or you know, we're not a VPN.
PE: Yeah, exactly. I mean, transparent doesn't obscure the end users IP or conceal that it's a proxy. So, it's not doing much. And elite proxy obscures the end users IP and conceals that as a proxy. So, those are probably the highest concern because they're truly kind of masking what's happening.
Got it. And then the fourth field that we have is related to proxy type. So that network or protocol that's utilized by the server to proxy the user connection. So, these are the technical details around how the proxy is working. So, HTTP is the HTTP protocol, Sox uses the Sox protocol, these both have open ports that are accessible by really any internet user. Sox, HTTP use both. And then web would be an internet browser. I mentioned the CGI where it's from a nested browser within a browser, and you can navigate to a website within a URL. Tor, the Onion router, so, the series of regularly changing nodes where traffic is aimed around that network by users that have opted in. And then finally service by far the most prevalent type with for the VPN providers where these are paid or have a subscription or membership.
JM: Got it. So, there's, there's a variety of ways then, from a technical basis. Proxies basically try to get around being detected, and they're using different protocols.
PE: Yeah, absolutely.
Now, there has also been in, we've been talking about IP addresses, you know, and basically, it's that address you get when you connect to the internet, whether it be from your home or your mobile device, etc. Now, there's been a shift for, and probably more technical people are in the know, on this. We've moved from a world from what we've called IPv4, to IPv6, which I think means Internet Protocol, v4 and Internet Protocol v6. Could you talk a bit about, you know, what does that mean in terms of the IP geo database?
PE: Sure. So each user that's connected to the internet, or each device has what's called an IP address, which is a unique identifier that identifies that device. In IPv4, it's 32 bits. So it's two to the 32 as a possible pool of IP addresses, which comes up to something like 4.3 billion possible IPs somewhere in there. And the problem that we're facing right now, or the issue that we're looking at, is with IPv4 address space exhaustion. So, we've actually allocated and effectively used all of the available IPv4 IP addresses. And you'll see kind of headlines once in a while where someone will sell a large block of IP addresses maybe that they weren't using for pretty significant amount of money. So, the exhaustion of the IPv4 address space is certainly a real issue, which led to the development of the IPv6 address space. I'm forgetting the date, but it's been around for a long time, but only recently have we really seen it leveraged and searched to be used in the wild. So IPv6 is 128bit meaning two to the 128, which works out to 340 undecillion, or a trillion, trillion, trillion IP addresses in IPv6.
JM: A trillion, trillion, trillion. Effectively, that's the coverage that if you're a streamer, it sounds like with this new brave new world of IPv6, that's the kind of coverage and understanding you need to have.
PE: Exactly. Yep, it makes the 4.3 billion IPv4 addresses look easy to track in comparison.
JM: 4.3 billion being much easier to track. So how just curious what is kind of the sausage making, if you will, around putting the IPv6 data together?
PE: Sure. So Neustar has been offering IPv6 data for several years now. And we've really been developing that data set and focusing on improving our data there. So, in the in the background, we're leveraging many of the same data attributes that we are for the IPv4 data. So everything from trace routes, meaning collecting traces to see where this IP is tracing to, seeing if there are labels in the host names for the routers that we can see and parse out to understand where an IP might be going, or located. Leveraging registry information. So, who is the IP range allocated to, who is responding for managing that range? These are can be ISP. And Comcast, Verizon. They can also be educational institutions, government, really anyone who has IP addresses allocated to them. We're also looking at partnerships with third party data providers to ensure that our granularity is there so that we are making the most accurate location assignments possible in IPv6.
JM: There isn't just a single source of truth out there for these trillion, trillion, trillion addresses. There's a there's a fair amount of, I was gonna say, art and actually probably science that goes into producing the data set it is now I know. And this is where shameless plug, as a former product manager as well for some of these products, could you talk a bit about UltraReputation is well, that's a product, that's a corollary to what we have for GeoPoint? And how might that help with content protection?
PE: Yeah, sure. So UltraReputation is our product that really provides information about IP addresses that we've seen, so exposes patterns that we've seen on our end and provides some scoring around those patterns. So, two main scores here that are available in UltraReputation, which basically describes the reputation of an IP address, as we have seen it. So, what do we think of the IP and what patterns have we seen? So, one of those scores is the real user score. On a scale of one to five, do we think this IP is coming from a real user, or from something like a hosting facility, a server a bot? And that is, again, is on a scale from one to five to help you evaluate. Is this end user a person? Or maybe it’s a machine or a server? The other primary score is the risk score. So that can also be leveraged to help understand how risky is this IP. What risky behavior have we seen, if any, and that can help content providers flag it as maybe cause for further investigation or reaching out to that account and saying: Is this you? Please call customer support to verify.
JM: Got it. Got it. So not only do we not only use their data around location around some of these IP addresses and these proxy attributes you described, but there’s also sort of, I guess you'd call it some risk factors as well.
PE: Yeah, exactly.
Got it. Got it. Well, I appreciate that. The deep dive on that. We're just about out of time. So, with that, just some parting thoughts, really, as we think about, you know, here we are, we're in May of 2021. We've talked about there's a light at the end of the tunnel, depending on where you are, that light is bigger. It certainly feels that way where I am. But as we think about movie theaters, and streaming, just you know, just a few thoughts as I as we sort of sorted through and sifted through this information. It's probably reasonable to expect movie theaters to rebound in time, as COVID subsides. It sounds like Paige, you said you'd be willing to go back, you are willing to go back when you feel comfortable.
PE: Yeah, certainly.
Yeah. And I’m the same way again, that has a lot to do probably with my children being able to be vaccinated as my wife and I are. And we, as you read what's out there, it looks like 2022 tends to be sort of the magic time. Now, I think defining rebound is probably the key because I think we've all gotten used to consuming our content online and streaming it. But you know, as I was thinking about that, and certainly that will continue to be the trend. I know and there are a lot of families or a lot of friends who enjoy going to the movies during the holidays. That is a big thing. I still remember going to see the Bodyguard. Again, dating myself, but seeing the Bodyguard with my parents, my aunt and uncle their kids, my grandma, was a big thing over the Thanksgiving holiday. Saw one of the Star Wars premieres I think the Rise of Skywalker during the holidays. There's always that pomp and circumstance that experience that big screen, I think there's always going to need a need for that. And so, you know, given time, I do think, you know, theaters will have a rebound. But obviously, as we've been saying, streaming isn't going anywhere. It's probably reasonable to think as things loosen up as we're able to be outside more and enjoy not just movie theaters but going out to restaurants. You know, and lounges, bars, etc. There's probably going to be some flattening for demand especially around, maybe the more legacy streamers. And, you know, and you could argue the newer streamers are going to have additional content that's not been previously available. But I do think, as Netflix, Netflix called out in their case, you know, the pandemic has really impacted their ability to create new content. And I think as again, as things start to relax, and new content can be produced, studios can reopen, and produce the same velocity they did before, it's reasonable think that even these legacy streamers will start to have a boon again, as they get more new content. And then finally, you know, from Neustar’s security perspective, you know, we've seen our traffic, again, increase 40% over the last year. And, and really, with that, have focused a lot on providing sort of content protection for the streamers that are out there. And I know Paige’s group has been working, you know, diligently, especially over the last 18 months to have a special focus on VPNs and proxies as we see more content being consumed.
So just a few parting thoughts as we end for today. Paige, thank you so much for joining. It's great talking to you - not on a conference call. We're actually going to do this in a podcast, which is kind of fun. Not the normal, weekly meeting, if you will. So, this has been great. Thank you for being here. Thank you, John.
Great, great. And thanks, everybody for joining. Appreciate your time and we'll be talking with you soon. Thank you.